What We Do With the Power We Have: A conversation on the impact of the Social Entrepreneur in Residence program with Ryan Pintado-Vertner
About This Episode
In 2020, Mission Partners was exploring the launch of an apprenticeship program to advance leaders in the communications and PR field with a specific and public race equity action plan to invest $2.5 million in Black and women-led organizations over five years.
As we started on that journey, we discovered some troubling data: 8% of agency leadership identified as Black, while 89.8% identified as White. During the period of February to April 2020, there was also a 41% drop in the number of active Black business owners, compared to a 22% drop in business owners overall and a 14% drop in White business owners.
That inspired us to create the Mission Partners Social Entrepreneur-in-Residence Program. This nine-month executive program is open to any Black communications agency leader with five years of business leadership. It provides executive coaching and a five-figure stipend to support their business giving back to the communities most important to them through their leadership and expertise.
Now, as we’re nearing the end of the first year of the program, we’ve invited Ryan to share his experience and guidance as we share our collected insights to those considering a similar program. Our great thanks to Ryan for his contributions and incredible insights as we have learned together on this journey.
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Carrie Fox:
Hi there and welcome to the Mission Forward Podcast, where each week we bring you a thought-provoking and perspective shifting conversation on the power of communication. I'm Carrie Fox, your host and CEO of Mission Partners, a social impact communications firm and certified B Corporation.
And if you're new to listening, well, I am glad you are here. At the Mission Forward podcast, we take on topics relevant to public communications and purpose driven professionals. We explore what's behind the most effective communicators and the most inclusive, accessible communications all in an effort to help you along your journey as a communicator for change. If you like what you hear, I hope you give this show a five star rating and share this episode or any of our other awesome shows with the people in your network.
Today's show is definitely going to be one to share because today's guest is Ryan Pintado-Vertner strategic marketing and brand expert, activist and founder of Smoketown. He brings decades of experience guiding fortune level brands, building startups, and leading nonprofit organizations. And if his name sounds familiar, it might be because Ryan appeared on season one of this podcast. We decided to bring him back to help us close season seven. Holy moly, season seven is closed with Ryan, right? We wanted to bring Ryan to do this show because, well, he's full of brilliant wisdom as you will also hear in his season one interview, but he's also the inaugural Social Entrepreneur in Residence at Mission Partners. It's a role he started last fall and he'll conclude formally later this month.
So listen in. We're going to talk about our partnership. We're going to talk about social impact. We'll talk about why together is always better and why our little pilot program has the potential to transform the future of our sector. Enjoy the show, we'll see on the other side.
So, hi Ryan, thanks for joining us back on the Mission Forward podcast.
Ryan Pintado-Vertner:
It's hard to believe that it's been so long since the last time.
Carrie Fox:
Do you know you were on season one?
Ryan Pintado-Vertner:
I was trying to remember which season it was, but no, I did not remember that.
Carrie Fox:
You're like a podcast founder like you are one of the originals, one of the original voices. So we're bringing you back. There's Vintage Ryan if you want to go back and listen to season one, but today we are going to be talking really specifically about your role as Mission Partners' Social Entrepreneur in Residence, and how lucky we all are to have you had been in that role for the past year. Now, for those who don't know what that is, Mission Partners' Social Entrepreneur in Residence, I'm going to ask that you all indulge me for just a moment. I'm going to give you some background and then we're going to do a formal intro of Ryan.
So here we are in 2023. If we go back three years, early 2020, actually pre-pandemic early 2020 Mission Partners was exploring this launch of an apprenticeship program. And it was part of our company's now very public race equity action plan and a very public commitment to move $2.5 million of our resources over five years to Black and women-led organizations.
And originally when we were building that race equity action plan, we were thinking about how we might advance leaders in the communications and PR field through an apprenticeship program. And very specifically, we were asking ourselves, "How can we help shape future agency owners?" And then I came across two pieces of data that really helped shift our thinking. And so now we are coming into early pandemic days, and I read in PR week that 8% of agency leadership identifies as Black, while 89.8% identify as white. And I thought, "Well, there is something seriously wrong about that." But to be followed up with this data point that during the time period of February through April of 2020, there was a 41% drop in the number of active Black business owners, that is compared to a 22% drop in the number of business owners overall and very specifically 14% drop in white business owners.
So, again, something clearly needed to be addressed here. And I couldn't help but wonder, and we were having some really interesting conversations with colleagues, this question of "what if" and those who listen to the show, might know I like to ask "what if". So what if, instead of creating an apprenticeship program for future agency business leaders, we took the same financial resources, we were going to be investing in that role and instead invested in an agency business leader right now. I mean, that was essentially the basis of the Mission Partner's Social Entrepreneur in Residence program, which became a nine-month executive program open to any Black communications agency leader with about five years of business leadership. And so along with that executive coaching is a five figure stipend that can support the scale and sustainability of their own firm.
So that brings us to today I am super proud to say that Ryan came on this journey with us. He applied for this first year of the residency, we are nearing the end of year one and since both of us kind of nerd out on data, we decided to do a real-time audit of what we learned and we want to share some of those things with other leaders who might be considering a similar type of program.
So, Ryan, how about you start by reintroducing yourself?
Ryan Pintado-Vertner:
Yeah, I'm happy to, and I'm really just so honored to get a chance to be here. So my name is Ryan Pintado-Vertner. I spent the first half of my career as an activist, didn't have even a remote interest in being in the corporate world, frankly, and then discovered how much power there is and working with consumer brands in particularly that have significant scale and the opportunity to change the world through a different lens than what I originally thought. And so one thing led to another. I had a surprisingly long career in consumer packaged goods in the core marketing function. And then I looked up one day and realized that I had strayed quite far from the core of who I was in terms of the kind of impact that I wanted to have on the world, the way that I wanted to help bend the moral arc of the universe towards justice as Dr. Martin Luther King put it.
And so I started a company called Smoketown about five years ago. Smoketown helps social enterprises and consumer brands make better marketing and innovation choices that maximize the growth that they have as organizations, but also maximizes the positive impact that they can have in the world without one of those choices compromising the other and the core way that we go about that is building deep partnerships that influence all aspects of marketing planning and strategy and innovation planning and strategy. And we do that with a core commitment to empathy. Empathy for both the founder or leader who's trying to figure out how to scale this thing, which is super hard to do and also empathy for the stakeholders and consumers that brand or organization is committed to serve.
Carrie Fox:
So when I first met you, I was blown away by how much insight you were sharing in a webinar, you probably don't even remember, but I remember calling you afterwards saying, "I kind of need to get to know you," because I'm kind of obsessed with how you think about empathy marketing. And then we got to talking and we found ways to work together. And then this kind of Social Entrepreneur in Residence started to take shape. Why did it feel like the right time in your career and in your business to think about applying for something like this?
Ryan Pintado-Vertner:
Yeah, well, I was struck by the way you opened and reminded me of that stat. And I'll tell you, there's a scenario in which my business was one of those statistics, a hundred percent, I think you said 41% or something like that. I mean, there was a very real scenario. I mean, my wife had to scrape me up off of the floor at peak COVID in order for this business to continue going. So by the time you and I met, I actually do remember that webinar, I remember it quite well. So by the time you and I connected, the business had bounced back. I felt confident that we had something still, but I felt alone in navigating how to build an agency. And I was just very more... Was very clear, more clear than I even had been before that I don't know how to build an agency. I've never worked in an agency. I've hired many, many agencies. I've fired a fair number of them too. But I had never built one. I didn't really know that business model and what struck me...
So generally that was sort of the need state that I had. I know I've got this thing, I've got a bunch of proof points that what we do has an impact and it has real potential, but I know what my weakness is. And then when you and I met what stood out to me right away, other than the fact that we shared a commitment to empathy and justice and that foundational important stuff, but the bottom line is you know how to run an agency and how to run it super well. And so it was obvious once I got a better understanding of what it was that you were offering and what was possible that there was a fit there.
Carrie Fox:
Well, you were very kind and as I have said to you many times, and I'll say here, the mutual benefit of this is way beyond what I imagined. I thought in the beginning, "I got a couple of things I could share. I've been doing this for a little while. There's some process we've put into place that have simplified how someone can run an agency. And there are relationships I think I can share that can help support a growing agency." But the reality is that it's been, and I have talked about this before, a win-win-win. It's been a win for business, in terms of the business we've been able to collectively grow. It's been a win for our clients, mine and yours, and it's been a win for us, literally me and you. Because you talk about how it's lonely to run an agency, Hey, 100%, I agree with that.
And so what I found in you as a thought partner and someone that every month we knew we could count on each other to show up and have some conversations about business, there's been so much benefit in that. And so I think that's where maybe, and I'll just tee that up and turn it back to you, but that to me feels like the most important theme to take away is that there's this depth of mutual benefit that is starting to come out of the Social Entrepreneur in Residence program. And I think you and I are still trying to untangle would this work for anyone to enter into this role? Or has it worked so well because you and I had some grounding?
Ryan Pintado-Vertner:
I came into this very much ready to be on the receiving end of a whole bunch of support. I didn't have a whole lot of pretense that I was bringing something other than needs to the table, quite frankly. But I think you're right that it's turned out to be quite a bit more mutually beneficial than I think either of us came into it expecting. And I wonder, part of that clearly is that you and I, your team and mine, we do highly complimentary work. We basically have immersed ourselves and become very, very good at the front end of marketing choices. Who are we trying to win with? Who are we competing with? How do we deeply understand that insight that makes someone tick? What does that mean for the kinds of choices we make and where you guys are capable of what I just articulated, but you have much deeper capacity and skills than I do in actually bringing that stuff to light, operationalizing the marketing plan, thinking through all aspects of messaging revision.
So I think that part of what worked is that we are highly synchronicitic in the way that we operate and what we do, but I'm not sure that that's the only driver of what makes these things mutually beneficial. I have a feeling that if we were to talk with mentors of any kind, I bet there's just a core thing that happens in generosity and giving and in being in service to someone else that you wind up getting just as much back as what you invest in. And I think that's probably a truism.
Carrie Fox:
That's true. Right. Right. Well, let's bring forward a story I had told you not too long ago that listeners might be interested in and our staff here at Mission Partners who's listening in I don't think knows this either, that when we first decided to do this, one of my former colleagues, former boss of mine, former partner of mine, and my longest serving mentor, Don Foley, said to me, "This is not just a really interesting idea to explore, the idea of Social Entrepreneur in Residence in an unlikely place in a small communications agency, but that what we're doing here has the potential to really challenge how agencies operate." And what he meant by that is for agencies who are looking to build a diversified staff and strategy, one of the first strategies that agencies will often go to is, what business can I acquire? What business can I basically buy?
And so what you saw in those early days of COVID when those Black-owned businesses were needing to close their doors, that there were white-owned businesses buying them because there was benefit to be had to be able to diversify a strategy for a white-owned business to buy a Black-owned business, and then suddenly to have a more diverse staff. But what does that really do to our sector and our industry and the ability to try to drive justice when you're thinking about that stat that less than 9% of agency owners are Black? And we inherently, we weren't thinking about that when we thought about the entrepreneur residence. We thought about why wouldn't we invest in someone who's doing this incredibly well and support your success? But that has stuck with me, and I know that stuck with you too.
Ryan Pintado-Vertner:
Yeah, for sure. I mean, it's a core part of why I'm still doing this, and I don't mean just narrowly being in partnership with you, but just why is Smoketown worth me climbing uphill continuously to achieve? And a big part of it is that I'm committed to having Black owned businesses thrive and be successful. So that's both with respect to the business that I myself have built but also me being in the decision making role to be able to pay that forward with other Black and Brown founders who I meet. I can't make that decision if I'm not the CEO, if I'm not the owner and if I don't really run the show. So I'm super clear that that's an important tenant for me, and I'm thankful that frankly, that option of even acquisition or majority purchase or whatever happens in the rest of the sector, I'm glad that that didn't even enter into our frame of consideration, right? Because, A, it wasn't what I wanted. And B, like I said, that's not what I'm in it for.
Carrie Fox:
Those listening who are thinking about doing something like this, you can read a lot about it. The program has been featured. We've got a lot of content about it on our website. But one important logistical piece about this is we very specifically did not want to take any sort of equity stake in your business, but we set this up as a stipend, a nine-month stipend that you are bringing expertise and insights to Mission Partners' clients, and in return, you're getting access to executive coaching, counsel support partnership. And so it really has been that kind of partnership that felt very important for us, not to say, and I would guide other leaders listening to this, that this isn't about making a gift to another agency owner. It's about getting true mutual benefit.
And that's where we're going to go because I noted at the top this win-win-win at play here. If we think about what we've been able to do together over these nine months that'll far outlive the Entrepreneur in Residence. Because if I think about the work we've been able to do for our clients, each of us respectively brings expertise to that work, Smoketown and Mission Partners, but when we bring it together, I found I have learned completely new ways of doing my work that has improved the process and that supports the client experience. And I wonder if you're feeling the same or what you're feeling in terms of how you've been able to better support your clients through this process.
Ryan Pintado-Vertner:
I definitely feel the same. Yeah. I think the thing that stands out for me, I mean, there's a few places, a better run agency is a better partner to a client. When we are better at being able to plan staff capacity, when we're better at pricing, when we're better at thinking through all of that stuff that happens on the back end of what makes this all work, then we're just easier to work with. So I'm quite sure even though our clients don't realize why things are even better than they were, like I'm sure that they are as a result of that. But then there's another piece of it, too, that has been a real source of value for us and for me, which is... Well, there's actually quite a few.
One thing that I mentioned to you recently is, you know, guys are a B Corp and I've thought about that. I haven't gone through the steps to pursue it, but mentally that's where I am. And I have to say that seeing how you make decisions through that filter, like who you're going to partner with, even in relatively small choices on the business, it has had a big impact on me and how I think about who we partner with and how. So I think that's another sort of place of unintended benefit and impact.
But where I was originally headed on that thread is that I think another piece that's been a great learning opportunity for us and for me is that because you and your team, you ultimately own all marketing, communications, execution, like you are literally the copyrighter, you directly reflect all of that strategy, high-minded stuff, into the real world. And it sort of keeps us real and has kept me grounded in a way that I really value. Strategy's biggest weakness is the risk of overthinking, the risk of it becoming an academic exercise that ultimately can't be put into practice. And while I think that we've done a pretty good job of managing to avoid that pitfall generally, there's nothing like being directly connected to the folks who ultimately have to execute to keep it real.
Carrie Fox:
Right. And I think what we had going for us too is we are so deeply values aligned. So again, for those leaders thinking about starting something like this, we never had to go back to square one and talk about, "Why are we doing this? What are we trying to achieve at the end of the day? Where are we trying to bring this client?" We were both on board with trying to challenge the client along the way, any given client that we've been able to work on together. And so yeah, that was the other piece that made me think, "Gosh, I thought we were doing really good work for these clients, but when Ryan enters in and asks his style of questions, we're taking them even farther." So there's this really depth of benefit that I feel like our clients are feeling too.
Ryan Pintado-Vertner:
Thank you.
Carrie Fox:
A win for the business. We set out part of this was a way we wanted to measure success is how much would your business grow and as a result, would there be any growth of my business too? And when we look at that, there has been, but there's been business we've been able to win together that we might not have been able to win alone. And so I think that that's, again, another important piece to think about for the bottom line, even though that's not what drives us.
Ryan Pintado-Vertner:
Definitely. Absolutely true. I would remove the "might have". There's definitely business that we won together that I had no shot at. No, for sure.
Carrie Fox:
Yeah. And I think what you've said is you've realized that your skills translate well beyond the specific sector that you were working on when we first started working together.
Ryan Pintado-Vertner:
Yeah, that's been a pleasant surprise. And I guess I shouldn't have been surprised. The first half of my career, I was in the nonprofit world. I worked for social and environmental justice organization and did that for a long time. Eventually had a leadership role in that, and we had to make a whole bunch of marketing choices, at that time I didn't think of them that way, frankly.
Carrie Fox:
Yeah.
Ryan Pintado-Vertner:
I didn't have that headset on. So hindsight's 20/20, I'm not surprised that what we do is transferable, but gosh, I'm really glad that turned out to be the case. It's been such a learning opportunity and such a treat to get a chance to work with folks like Prism and just see that team light up and take off. I mean, I'm so glad that we discovered that and that we discovered there's that synergy there.
Carrie Fox:
Yeah.
Ryan Pintado-Vertner:
Because that stuff, I will remember that kind of work forever.
Carrie Fox:
Well, and I think it just points spot-on to your ability to scale your business because your skills are so transferable that I hope you take with you that the market is far greater than you might have first realized on who could benefit from working with Smoketown.
Ryan Pintado-Vertner:
Yeah. Thank you. Thank you.
Carrie Fox:
You. So we've talked about a couple win-win-wins here. So for those who are listening, if you are thinking about ways to broaden your impact, think about what a partnership could do for you, what a Social Entrepreneur in Residence could do for you. For us here in this industry, it's been a win for our clients, a win for business, a win for us as partners and thought leaders in this work to have one another through this process.
And then I'll leave you with one final thought and Ryan turn it back to you. But there's this final big win that we seem to be sitting with that there is potentially something emerging here that could be a challenge and a win for our industry. And it goes back to those first data points that if the communication sector really cares about their diversity and equity strategies, then look a little harder at what partnerships could do. Look a little harder at what mutual benefit comes out of that rather than rushing to the, "What can we acquire, what can we own strategy." So yeah, Ryan, we still have a few weeks left in the Entrepreneur in Residence. We are getting ready to, well, we are still open with applications, so individuals who are interested in applying for the next Mission Partners' Social Entrepreneur in Residence can do that. But what do you want to leave folks with today as you think about this conversation we're having and Social Entrepreneur in Residence in general?
Ryan Pintado-Vertner:
Yeah, I think where I'll leave it is pick up on something that you said a moment ago. One thing that I just have to be straight up about is we're now, gosh, I've lost track, we're a few years since George Floyd was murdered. And frankly speaking, there was a surge that lasted about 18 months of white folks making anti-racist commitments and that's in the rear view mirror now. I would say very, very significant drop drop in the number of programs and level and commitments, what you set out to do a few years ago. And so what I would put out there is that I hope that there are folks in the audience who will take you up on reconsidering this kind of an investment in this kind of a partnership, either in the same sector or in a different one because the fact is that racism didn't take a holiday. It's just because we're not in the midst of mourning another Black man murdered. It hasn't changed the fact that there's very real structural inequalities that are baked into many of these sectors and need real allyship to step up and make anti-racist commitments and choices. So my hope is that there's someone in the audience who maybe dabbled in this, maybe flirted with it, didn't make the move, but is more likely to now.
Carrie Fox:
Yeah. Thank you for that. And for those listeners who are saying, "I can't make a dent on this issue, it's too big. Great job, Ryan, Carrie, moving on." Right? I would ask you again to stop and say, but "what if". What if you tried? What if you thought about the bit of progress you could make in your company, in your industry, there could be a tipping point here. And that tipping point, I think, is what we're all collectively trying to move forward to.
So, all right. Well, Ryan, we still got a few weeks left, so I'm not saying goodbye to you as our Social Entrepreneur in Residence just yet. We got a whole lot more to plan and do together, and certainly well beyond Social Entrepreneur in Residence. But I will share enormous gratitude for being a thought partner as we kicked off a pilot program year. We've been doing a lot of research and tracking along the way. We've got Sadie Lockhart and Nira Haru listening in today who have been literally documenting this program since day one, so we could present some findings to share in a more formal way. And thanks for being a great, truly great partner through this process.
Ryan Pintado-Vertner:
I mean, yeah, thank you for the opportunity. It's been a tremendous honor. I'm glad it's not over yet though.
Carrie Fox:
And that brings us to the end of Mission Forward podcast season seven. This has been an especially great ride and I appreciate you being along for it. While we're taking a break for the summer with any new long form content, we will have some great reruns of episodes back, and we will continue to bring you new short form essays all the way through the end of August. So tune in.
Mission Forward is brought to you with support from Sadie Lockhart at Mission Partners and the awesome production team at True Story, including the great and truly great Pete Wright.
If you have enjoyed this show, head over right now and give us a five star review so more people can benefit from this content. And then head over to missionforward.us to learn more about the show, learn more about our content, maybe pick up my book if you haven't done that yet. And until next time, friends, be well and go make some good impact.
